What if Steam was just the best option?  What other services allow sharing game saves across multiple computers, installing to different machines, unlimited download of the game/patches, access to the community and other players from within the game, and a way for a huge number of potential clients to be reached and purchase your product? Does Impulse really offer all that?

Personally, I don't want it tied to any one service, Steam, Impulse or otherwise.

I like Impulse.  I can turn Impulse completely off and still game.

Can I ask why?  Other than the "Steam is becoming a monopoly" reply - why wouldn't you want a unified location where things such as mods/friends/patches are seamlessly integrated and can be accessed  from one unified location,,,without having to jump to website A to get a mod, then website B for a patch, and then use third party product C to find multiplayer games?  

People are complaining about spending the minimal requirements of RAM steam requires - yet pushing for having to install things such as gamespy to find matches, ...or complaining about having to spend 2 extra seconds clicking out of steam to close it - yet they want to track down patches from various websites, download them and apply it themselves...wouldn't that require more than the two seconds steam might? 

Hi Nesrie,

I believe you have misunderstood me. If you read https://forums.elementalgame.com/381719/page/10/#2616059 the post immediately prior to the one I just made, you would see that I was specifically talking to Dale_ who I felt made a dubious claim. He seemed to be saying that we do not own the games we buy, we only hold licences to them. In the first post I provided the links to the court cases that have explictly ruled otherwise. The second post was an admonishment about unresearched claims.

Reading my post, you'd see I was agreeing with you.

@ KickACrip

Those steps you describe are USER CONTROL. When Steam gets control there is no other option but what Steam allows.

I "DO NOT" want any part of it.

@ everyone else

Steam is for cooking vegetables.

Are you a vegetable.

Well first off, selecting Impulse (to answer your question) would still allow you to sell it on Steam (and D2D and GamersGate and so on). So you increase the number of users you can reach.

As for the rest, Civ is primarily a single player game. Being able to access friends within game seems like a pretty minor thing (and again, they could still let those users do so via Steam or what have you).  Impulse::Reactor will support this but not within the time they would have "evaluated" Impulse as an option. Not that 2K ever contacted us to find out.

But Impulse supports saving games across multiple computers, installing to different machines, unlimited download of game/patches.  And point of fact, Impulse does have around 3 million active accounts. No where near Steam's number (25 million) but it's hardly a case that 2K isn't aware of Impulse -- they sell Civilization IV on Impulse.

I can't say what the "best" option for 2K is.  But in my opinion, that option would be the one that leads to the most sales. Being able to sell through fewer channels with some percentage of users unwilling to purchase it strikes me as a "non best" way of doing it.

Except that the only "control" being exhibited by Valve is that you have to have the client to run the game.

In turn, you can download the game on any computer at any time when you're logged into your Steam account. You get all the same integrated client features you find off of any other Valve game. You even get free stuff tossed in with automatic updating.

To me and the PC-user base backing 75% of the digital gaming market, this is good news. I find it hilarious that all the people who had to download Impulse to play Demigod are complaining that Civ V requires the exact same thing, except with Steam. They even said that it wasn't required to be running.

Not true - even with Steam you can easily install mods to the game yourself (downloading from the mod site, and installing it yourself) - you can even turn off the option to receive patches.  You can set it up to play offline, the only complaints seem to be a "prevention of a future monopoly" or the "I just don't want it installed on my computer."  Oh, there's also a "I don't wanna take 2 seconds to start it up" thing. 

So no I don't agree with "there is no other option than what Steam allows."

Personally, the advantages of not needing a CD to play, easily uninstalling it when I get bored and then installing it again a few months later (without having to get the CD/CD key), having access to community features IN GAME, having a centralized location where the game is, and not having to keep tabs with when the current patch is released - are all advantages I'm happy we have today. 

I think most people don't like having to jump through hoops to play their single player game. Obviously, you don't consider them to be much of an inconvenience, but doing anything other than clicking the game icon to play single player is an inconvenience to me. Also, all of Steam's advantages mean pretty much nothing to me as I either already experience them without Steam or don't find them useful.

Did you look up what Copyright actually means, or did you just find a couple of specific points to try to refute me?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyright

What was that?  Oh yes, copyright holders by law are able to exercise their exclusive rights to control copying and exploitation of their works.

That's all I do to play single player Steam games.  Just double-click the desktop icon (which Steam makes for me too).  

Good post...but is it possible that releasing across multiple platforms (steam, Impulse, D2D) would cause a split in the community?  Wouldn't it make sense to choose one service, and then focus on integrating the community features into that?  Obviously I don't know what they mean yet by "community features",,,but if it's a place where mods are released to and easily accessed and installed from - it seems like one centralized location would make the most sense. 

I guess I need to wait and see what it evolves into though...

Actually if any of my friends buy an rts off of steam they can't use my custom maps.  Also steam likes to make people pay for mods and such.   Kind of kills some of the advantages of playing a game on pc.

@ KickACrip  It's nice that you like steam, and I respect your right to want it and have it.  It would also be nice for 2k to respect the right of people like myself who don't want steam. 

All we're asking for is a choice, so you can get what you want, and we don't have to get what we don't want.

Why we don't want it is unimportant.  What is important is that steam is not necessary and many long time players of Civ (almost 20 years for me, and I've bought every Civ game) don't want it forced upon us. 

That they're trying to spin it as us being able to "...enjoy the benefits of the Steamworks..." is PR double-speak, and is insulting.

I have already explained in this thread why I don't want/need steam, but will expand a bit.  Here's part of the PR doublespeak:

"...players will enjoy the benefits of the Steamworks' features included in all PC versions such as auto-updating, Steam Achievements, downloadable content, multiplayer matchmaking and more."

Auto-updating: I've done this just fine on my own.  Civ already has a "check for updates" feature, and if that's not working it's simple to manually find and apply updates.

Achievements: couldn't care less for them.  If I thought about them I'd think they're harmful as they'd encourage goofy play.

DLC: I look at DLC not as "extras" for those who pay more, but as having to pay more for what would otherwise be included in the basic price.  I also see it as another way to get squeeze more blood from the gamer turnip.  I understand why some companies to it, but don't like it and consider it a negative not a 'benefit I'll enjoy'.

Multiplayer Matchmaking: I've seen the random pickup player base.  I expect Civ to have a higher quality class of folks, but still I don't play with strangers.  I play with friends/acquaintances and so don't need/want this 'benefit'.

'and more': unenumerated 'benefits' don't impress me.

I see problems with steam/steamworks.  I don't like unnecessary programs running.  I don't like unnecessary programs installed even when they're not running.  I don't like unnecessary programs occasionally calling out without my permission (zone alarm outbound control is a good thing).  And I don't like having something forced upon me, especially when it benefits 2k and not me, and double especially when they try to blow smoke up my ass regarding how it's a 'benefit I'll enjoy'.

Capiche?